Sadly, me being on the other side of the world - $20 discount for 4 sets doesn't make the difference for $108 shipping rates for 4 times shipping, each contains a set.TheGentlemanWake wrote: ↑Tue May 23, 2023 2:03 pm The sets are $94.99 for the next week. Then prices go up to $99.99. That's a $20 discount over the life of the series. $380. And we are planning on some special gifts for customers of all 4 series per year.
@playingcardophile
Keep in mind that value is a pretty subjective term. So I absolutely understand why you feel my snipe being untrue.
.
.
TheGentlemanWake wrote: ↑Tue May 23, 2023 2:16 pmdouble_left wrote: ↑Tue May 23, 2023 2:12 pm What about my time in cultivating relationships, building a brand, creating an audience and follower base, running budgets, establishing production partners and building and running a website? ... Surely you MUST understand that the value of a product is NOT only the cost of the materials involved right?TheGentlemanWake wrote: ↑Tue May 23, 2023 2:11 pmspeaking for myself, perhaps others, the issue isnt supporting a brand or that you are growing a brand. the issue is that brand seems to be bent on gating decks of cards, which is what most of us are in the hobby for, behind high priced extra items. extra items that cause you to have all of this extra time and whatnot in ''running budgets, establishing production partners'' etc. that is all self inflicted and then passed onto the consumer who may just want to buy the decks but we cant because you have to factor in all of these extra costs across the whole range of items. you dont, or cant, offer just the decks at what just the decks cost because you need to cover all of these extra costs and time. if you just produced decks, then all of this extra stuff you wouldnt even have to do and then justify passing on costs.
this has all been said before multiple times by multiple people. you have a vision and you stick with it come hell or high water. admirable in a way. as you have put it elsewhere, we are only a few of the little voices here. personally, i purchase products and items, not brands. in many cases, the brand actually deters me from buying the products because they price themselves out.
seems like i didnt do all the quotes right but i am not redoing it lol. this is the most clunky quoting system around.
Then do we really have to keep saying it?STLBluesNut wrote: ↑Wed May 24, 2023 8:52 am this has all been said before multiple times by multiple people.
Harvonsgard wrote: ↑Wed May 24, 2023 3:16 amKeep in mind that value is a pretty subjective term. So I absolutely understand why you feel my snipe being untrue.
I have some TXI decks of the past and I have no problem to remind people that TXI was at the forefront and amongst the pioneers of custom playing cards and they earned their spot rightfully. However, I live in the present and I'm not one of the guys who gives credits for past achievements. I gave then my money in the past so I call it quits in that regard. Nowadays they are painstakingly stagnant and boring. Same as e.g. Riffle Shuffle (aka Card Mafia) and other formula baking companies. I know - fans of the franchises they do decks for will disagree but I'm no fan of any particular franchise so.
Value for me is craftsmanship, artistry, all that stuff that is mostly (but not necessarily) contrary to mass produced stuff.
That's why I'm btw. still very critical towards TGW decks and don't own any, because at the end of the day the decks are still "just" Cartamundi cold foil decks - which just don't impress me much. And I'm perfectly fine with anyone disagreeing whit that.
but that was in a different thread lol. there are a lot of comments and topics covered multiple times on any forum, group, subreddit etc. human nature i suppose to keep voicing the same opinion even though it has been said before but in the context of a new/different discussion. i know i am guilty obviously.Sir Toddalot wrote: ↑Wed May 24, 2023 10:52 amThen do we really have to keep saying it?STLBluesNut wrote: ↑Wed May 24, 2023 8:52 am this has all been said before multiple times by multiple people.
Omar, is there any chance of you reconsidering using a EU based fulfilment center?TheGentlemanWake wrote: ↑Tue May 23, 2023 12:36 pm Due to the limited quantity and for simplicity's sake, we will be fulfilling from Texas (Gambler's Warehouse) only.
the choice you have is to not buy them and look at pictures posted here when you want to see them. look, i am not, in any way advocating for some kind of boycott here but this sort of mentality is how situations get to where they are. not just with this deck. not just with playing cards. folks just say i dont like it ''although what choices do I have'' and purchase or support whatever product or practice it is anyway. this just encourages more of the same behavior. whether it be buying a particular product, supporting a particular business model or paying ridiculous prices from scalpers on ebay.laitostarr777 wrote: ↑Thu May 25, 2023 8:49 am
At first, I was about to skip this: due to the forcing of the walnut case, although what choices do I have in order to see these decks.
The 1000 unit limit is set. The price is set to go UP as soon as the introductory offer goes away. The base price will never be reduced. I can tell you that the BASE price of the set will not be eligible for discounts for ONE YEAR AFTER FULFILLMENT. So if the decks are delivered in November that means the EARLIEST these decks would even be eligible for discount would be Nov 2024, a YEAR after they were in your hand--AND THAT'S IF THEY HAVEN'T SOLD OUT BY THEN. Your value is protected.Swiski66 wrote: ↑Thu May 25, 2023 11:47 am Would you consider this a "produce-on-demand" item, or are 1000 units already in production? In other words, if you only get a specific amount of pre-orders for this by a set date, will the final production number be less than 1000? I only ask because I hope there is some reassurance or reward for day 1 pre-ordering customers such as myself. I'd hate to see this set discounted at half off one day because of people waiting or delaying to order it. The same thing happens to Star Wars toys, which I also collect. The pre-order date from online stores has a set price, but then collectors wait a year later and then buy it at a discounted. I don't want to keep falling into the trap of being the sap who pays full price for something when others get the item later on clearance.
Everytime I read that someone thinks a creator should charge less for a product it boils my blood. It's SO disrespectful to a producer to tell them what they should charge. If someone doesn't want to pay the price? Then they shouldn't. But NO ONE has the right to tell anyone else what their time or their products are worth. Even the market/economy is limited in it's ability to dictate that change. The only one who has the right to change that perception is the producer themselves.STLBluesNut wrote: ↑Thu May 25, 2023 12:26 pm me personally? $85 for these 2 decks? any 2 other decks pretty much? not a chance. i would encourage any designers to look at charmie dreams campaigns. great art. gilded and foiled. (going of memory here) sub $35. with box, coin and booklet about $45. these are not chinsy boxes or coins either. hell, even Ark campaigns and i still have not bought one of their sets. king star sets, some of them (i do have 2 of these). the mucha set that was on KS.
i have said in several posts that i do not buy box sets. i guess that is technically not true, but in general i do not. but i bought those. why? because the decks were reasonably priced, they were offered separate and the box set didnt add much to the cost. as a consumer and hobbyist, i can see that it is possible to have reasonably priced ''luxury'' items so i am not paying double+ whatever the explanation for the cost is. i dont care about the name or image of the brand. the name of the designer. the ''limited'' quantity. i think if one were to poll some of the buyers here, someone like charmie dreams has made a stellar reputation and brand for himself by offering, what i would consider luxury by the features they have, items at a great price. the last campaign had 1593 backers for over $170k. i guess 1/4 or 1/3 buying a product at 2x+ the price is good too.
i am not sure why i get so passionate in the TGW threads. i think it is because i love you, Omar. i really really want to support what you are doing but you make it so god damn hard to do so. if i didnt, i would probably just view a campaign/offering and just move on as with probably 90% of the stuff out there.
TheGentlemanWake wrote: ↑Thu May 25, 2023 12:45 pm
Everytime I read that someone thinks a creator should charge less for a product it boils my blood. It's SO disrespectful to a producer to tell them what they should charge. If someone doesn't want to pay the price? Then they shouldn't. But NO ONE has the right to tell anyone else what their time or their products are worth. Even the market/economy is limited in it's ability to dictate that change. The only one who has the right to change that perception is the producer themselves.
it is probably semantics and maybe not the way you meant it but ANYONE has the RIGHT to tell anyone else almost ANYTHING (in the US anyhow). with obvious criminal exceptions. however, the whole point of my post was not, nor did i, to tell you, or anyone else, what to charge but to point out other projects/producers/creators that make products at a, imo, reasonable price to me.
The proudest i've ever felt about a product bearing my brand is the Sarcophagus. The elation and praise from collectors who have received theirs makes it beyond satisfying. That BOX SET was the vision from the beginning. Why can't folks understand that boxsets aren't all about 'gatekeeping' or paywalls.
not even getting back into the sarcophagus discussion. that was your vision, you made it a reality. very good on your for your work and perseverance.
And you can say, STLBluesNut, that all you WANT is to support me... but the proof is in the pudding. What you ACTUALLY want is for me to capitulate and devalue my brand to meet YOUR perception of what its worth. I WON'T DO THAT FOR ANYONE.
i do truly want to support you and buy your products. the ''proof [that] is in the pudding'' is that when there are not options available at prices i find reasonable then i do not purchase. you certainly to not have to capitulate to anything anyone says, let alone one voice in a proportionately small community. you have made that abundantly clear in word and action the you will not do that. i cannot find in my post where i told you or anyone else to do anything. i cannot find where i even asked anyone to do anything. i did encourage any designer to look at some examples i gave of multiple projects. i stated my opinions and thoughts for anyone to read. i suppose the last 3 sentences were actually directed towards or about you specifically. at the beginning i answered a question you asked.
i am also of the opinion that, for example, offering all decks apart from having to buying extra items with prices based only on the decks would not devalue a brand. i personally have never read or heard anyone say something remotely close to '' what a cheap ass brand, i have the option to buy every item independent of having to buy some other item. pass." i have seen on many occasions some express that they bought a 2 or 3 deck set, box set, etc but were happy to see you could get things separately. charmie projects, for example. i feel like a brand would grow more/faster by having those kind of options available.
AND ONE MORE THING, I've never backed a Charmie project. So I can't speak to the quality of their decks, but I would wager that Cartamundi decks cost more to produce than WJPCC decks do. Probably by a considerable margin. So this isn't an apples to apples comparison.
and this is why i encouraged any designer to check out his projects, among others. regardless of printer, coin/box/booklet manufacturer, artist, brand, etc., imo, this is what i think a reasonably priced, quality set with all of the deck features available can look like. it may not be a granny smith to granny smith comparison but i certainly think it is apples to apples. maybe green to red apples.
As if the aftermarket is a common place for keeping in touch with reality, haha. Not to mention inflation, lol.double_left wrote: ↑Thu May 25, 2023 5:29 pm I’m sure -based off Omar perception that these decks will only go up in value and is why he’s selling 1000 per-order at a heart-warming discount for all of us, you’ll be able to find them on the after market for $50-$60 in years to come.
Sometimes creators get out of touch with reality and will go to the end of the world to justify their beliefs
